Baldur

-y +t

kmkagle

Can't keep quiet anymore....Baldur, why are you apologizing for being offended. You're not the only feeling this way. I think they call it compassion, a wonderful trait have. As was stated, more or less. We all have our opinion. I, along without a doubt, many others, feel the same way you do about this. Thank you for your "heroic voice"!!! How's that?

kmkagle

Correction: Can't keep quiet anymore....Baldur, why are you apologizing for being offended. You're not the only person feeling this way. I think they call it compassion, a wonderful trait to have. As was stated, more or less, we all have our opinions and are entitled to them. I, along without a doubt, many others, feel the same way you do about this. Thank you for your "heroic voice"!!! How's that?

Dragon

While I understand where Ron is coming from (his post did not make me angry and it did make me think), I still don't agree with a lot of what he said.
I said it before, offensive is in the eye of the beholder. My opinion is we need to look at the spirit of the picture. If swastikas are portrayed in an effort to make people think, to inform or something of that nature - they should not be considered offensive. Just as most of the Christian images are done out of a love of faith, or a wish to pass the artists passion along should not be considered offensive.
If, however, the swastikas are presented as an "In your face, look at the shocking things I can draw." or as symbols for intolerance and hate then they are offensive.

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I didn't see the swastikas, so can not comment on them ... but there were sexually explicit drawings yesterday. I think they do not belong here ... there are plenty of other sites around to cater for it. I think Baldur has got it right.

Baldur

I think we all do the best to stand by our convictions.

Ron is apparently firmly against censorship which is fine, but it doesn't stop me from hitting the report button.

He did post a forum comment regarding offensiveness that I did not contribute to, just a few days ago. It is very good reading.
He wanted opinions on what our reactions would be if he posted images that were non-Christian based.
I have wondered the same thing since the Christ oriented images have proliferated in recent weeks. Certainly not everyone here appreciates Christianity being thrust into the limelight. What if the images were Islamic? Wiccan? or even Scientologist in nature?


Ron is not reading this link any longer so it would be best to give him your impressions on this topic back on his original thread

(oh, kmkagle, my intention was not to apologize for being offended, it was rather my apologies should my being offended in turn offends Ron)

kmkagle

I misread the statement, my apologies. I will take my stand (this is my opinion) that some things have to be censored. I could say more but don't dare, learned a lesson.

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Ron is as human as the rest of us ... he'll read this.

Baldur

I really don't mind yanking a few chains here and there.

There have been plenty of threads that have not gotten a nibble from me despite my having a strong opinion on the topic.
We all pick our battles when we can.

If I get painted as close-minded on this one so be it

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No danger there, Baldur.

sheftali52

All--I hope I wasn't the one who set everything on fire. I believe tolerance is good, but I also think we have to stand up for what we believe are reasonable standards. I am not "offended" by much, per se, but surely there is a point where the line is crossed. I was always taught to stand up for what I thought was right, and I will continue to do so, in as diplomatic a fashion as I can.

kmkagle

We have another situation tonight. First page, nothing but trash. I hope no children clicked on gallery about 45 minutes ago. The pictures were peppered her and there, then titles were changed.

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I fully understand Ron's arguments against censorship but I ask you this, Ron: If you were walking down the main street with your young nephews and neices and you turn a corner, see obscene goings on in front of you, wouldn't you turn around and take them another way? If you were there on your own, wouldn't you object? If there were obscene drawings on the walls in front of your house, would you simply keep the curtains drawn?
I think you are a resonable and decent sort of person and, like most of us, would wan't the obscenities stopped/ removed. (I'm not talking about swastikas, because I didn't see them or the context in which they were displayed)

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The point I am trying to make is that the Gallery and Showcase are TD's High Street ... obscenities and lewd drawings are best kept out of it, otherwise the whole thing will descend into mayhem.

matthew

There are obscene pics & there are offensive pics...

I agree that this should be an obscene free sight (obscenity offends me... lol)...

Offensive pics to one group are perfectly fine to another group. Therefor a difficult line to draw...

For example, my Jesus pic was offensive to some & was censored, but to most it was not...

I just can't draw the line...

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Matthew, I agree with you ... there is a thin line between offensive and obscene. My point is that, if sexual acts or lewd behaviour would be unacceptable in a public place, such as a main thoroughfare, a hotel foyer, a doctors waiting room or any place where it is not normal for such things to take place, then it is unacceptable here. I'm not a prude ... I simply believe there is a right and wrong place for everything. There are such paintings and drawings in art galeries ... we know they are there and when we come across them we are not shocked because they are not unexpected and are accepted as having a rightful place there. You could argue that this is an art gallery ... personally, I see this as a public place where I would be quite happy to leave children to play for a while.

Regarding your Jesus drawing, I believe that the majority of us did not find it offensive. (Forgive me if I get this wrong ... I've lost track of it all) ... It got a lot of votes and was very prominent. Then it got voted down, as has become the norm (more's the pity) and you were rather put out about that. You made quite a fuss at the time and made your feelings plain in the forum. Your comments were followed by varying views (and why not). Sadly it didn't end there ... it got more hits and a few opposing comments and you became very angry. In your temper, you put multiple drawings of the same picture up ... your anger was plain to all of us. It became a big issue. I assume that some had tired of it all by then and decided that if they hit the report button, they could put a stop to it. How wrong they were.

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What I now find difficult to understand is why Ron, in his own way, has censored this thread by refusing to read our responses ... or have you, Ron?

matthew

My anger was on that pic being censored... Not being voted down...

I have gotten very used to my pics being voted down...

Either way, I do not wish to visit the subject again...

That is why I said that I have no intrest in drawing the line...

My frustration over the censorship issue is gone...

I just want to have fun & draw...

I will not chose sides... I will not draw lines... I will not get in trouble by doing so...

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I'm glad your anger and frustration have gone, matthew. Your drawings are showing it, too ... love your 'memory game' in Showcase.