indigo

I agree with Marg...I vote for the KISS system also!

stevedover1965

I just deleted a picture because of down voting, it had only been on the gallery for a short while and it got 3 votes with no comments achieving 2.2 voting like that is designed to dishearten an individual. This KISS system needs to happen because I am fed up with votes being used as a weapon.

stevedover1965

To put things in perspective someone posted one of the pre-drawn backgrounds with absolutely nothing added the other day and got a higher vote than the one I just deleted which took me an hour to do. I wasn't deleting the picture (I can re-create that) I was deleting the vote.

stevedover1965

I'm glad I deleted that picture because it spurred me on to do this one as a replacement: http://www.thinkdraw.com/picture.php?pictureId=122860

And I don't care what the vote is because I wanted to do my best and stick my fingers up defiantly at the spoiled voter.

Pumpkingirl

Why does danila down vote pictures? She just down voted two of mine ( I can see in the updates that it was her) and she just down voted some other beautiful pictures that where submitted this morning. What is the reason for this?

polenta

What? Are you sure? Danila is a great artist. Whay would she need to do so? What is sure is that people downvote. Please Rachel, either only have a YES or NO or let each vote be added. I mean 5 +5+1 would mean 11 so nobody can downvote. WE NEED IT BADLY.

clorophilla

I also strongly support the KISS idea! I don't care very much about downvoting, but other people get very upset for this, it brings in suspects and doubts (see Pumpkingirl message) and it's a pity if some great artist (as Stevedover is) will delete a pic for this!

Pumpkingirl

polenta to answer your question, yes I am sure. I was going back and forth to my updates to watch all the play backs of the pictures that I commented on. That is the easiest way to get to the pictures again to watch how the artist made them. I was watching Qsilv amazing picture and flipped to my updates to get to the next picture, that is when I saw her comment and down vote. Off coarse I got upset then started to check the following picture next to mine....and saw that the same thing happen to some of them . I just wanna know why this is being done? We all put time and effort into our pictures, and it's rude that some people just insult others.
I don't mean to start any trouble...I just want to understand why this is being done. Maybe I should just stop drawing here like my Dad has suggested. Thanks for your kind works on my picture, it made me feel better.

stevedover1965

Currently there is a view to add an option to remove voting altogether, I would not like that because I really enjoy trying my hardest to achieve the highest votes I can, it spurs me on to try harder and produce a picture that I hope everyone else will like. Polenta and some others have suggested the KISS method which means whatever the vote it is added to the overall total so in effect there can never be a down vote. This is what I would like to see established as the voting system on TD. Rachel I wish to add my voice to the others who advocate this method of voting. Thank you.

stevedover1965

PS Clorophilla thanks for your compliment, psst I wish I was a great artist but ... I'm not, but thanks for saying that, truth is there are a lot of inspired people creating stuff on TD (yep that includes you as well) and KISS system can only benefit this website.

stevedover1965

Sorry keep adding things, but Pumpkingirl, I know it is disappointing when you work really hard on a picture for someone to vote it down. But it is the system that is at fault, which is why some of us would like to see it changed. You are doing really well and producing some lovely pictures, maybe Rachel at TD will change the system, then you wont need to worry about your average score being lowered against public opinion.

clorophilla

It was a pity if you, Pumpkingirl, who are a so gifted artist, would stop drawing here just bc of some stupid downvoting. We are all enjoying and learning each other here, ad few peolple who spent so badly their time for cheating or trying to give trouble, well... I'm sorry for them, bc it don't worth their efforts: we all enjoy anyway, and the downvote no more has an impact on the top 5 scoring.

Anyway, Pumpingirl, there are many people on the site every moment, and it's possible to comment and not vote, or to vote and not comment, and as the voting is anonymous, you can't never really know who is voting.

Dragon

I do also advocate a simple system for the votes, ideally (in my mind) a simple "I like this" vote so there's no confusion or downvoting.

Pumpkingirl, your work is really very good and I'm with steve in hoping this won't discourage you.

To give danila the benefit of the doubt it is within the realm of possibility that someone else was simply looking at the same pics at the same time she was and happened to downvote at the same time. Also some people don't think a pic is quite worth a 5 vote in their opinion but they still really like the pic and give it a 3 or 4 instead, they don't mean it to be insulting or to bring your total down, they're just vote the way they feel is appropriate. Personally I gave up voting a long time ago because I felt like I could never give anything less than a 5 or it the artist would feel hurt, so I simply stopped voting altogether. That's not a solution for everyone but it works for me and if it means that other people don't want to vote for my pics because they know I won't vote no matter how incredible I think a piece is that's alright. I never really expect mine to get into the top 5 so I don't feel that frustration that others do who are really doing everything they can for that distinction.

five

My last response disappeared.

To be clear, I asked for the option to not have pictures voted on -- leaving it up to the artist. The artist can leave their pics up for vote and put up with the problems in the voting system, whether it is the current system, KISS or another system.

Personally, I see no good way to make the voting system. If it is KISS, then with adding +1 (or + any number less than 5) the intent and effect of the lower vote is going to be the same as it is when the number is subtracted -- to give a lower vote sum -- except it won't be averaged to take a "Perfect" 5 down (the "perfect" in a KISS system will be the 5 times the number of votes for the pic). And it will feel like a down vote, unless most TD'ers start regularly voting somewhere between 1 and 5, instead of just 5 (which may also cause some hurt feelings when votes come without explanation). The point of averaging, as I understand it, is to meliorate the issue that some TDers may just have more friends who vote on their pics, regardless of the relative quality of an individual picture (heck, it's subjective, isn't it?), to give newbies or those with few "friends" on TD a chance. The algorithm that includes favorites has been a really good step, and down voted pictures make it to Top 5 (which is why I don't understand the downvote or reduced vote that would occur absent a subtraction system). I applaud TD's efforts to make the voting work as fairly as they can. [If it were just favorites, which are limited in number, some would lose the ability to save the pics that just touch them for whatever reason, regardless of whether they think the pic is the "best" -- I think a fair number of us use favorites that way.] TD could hide the voting completely, but most of us can spot the Top 5 contenders, so it would not stop the down-voting and some people are spurred on by their vote total.

I just want to opt out of voting altogether. Maybe I'll get my wish. Good luck to all.

Pumpkingirl, your pictures are great and always improving. You have so much talent!

polenta

http://www.thinkdraw.com/picture.php?pictureId=112980

This incredible picture doesn't have a perfect 5. In my opinion, someone downvoted it but the avalanche of votes compensated the downvoting.
Some other amazing drawings are not that lucky.
As for the lack of votes or comments, it's each TDer's choice but these two things are what make TD's difference. It wouldn't be as fun as it is now even though we are free to decide.

Shanley

As I previously said, the KISS system is a great alternative to the current vote system, but I wonder if anybody has mentioned it in the Thinkdraw feedback forum.

stevedover1965

I am saddened to find out that in protest of their pictures being constantly down voted TD member (five) is leaving us. If KISS (Keep It Simple Stupid) i.e all votes are positive to the score, is implemented, perhaps with a simple like this tick along with comments. The down voters would have no ammunition. It has been mentioned in feedback to Rachel. So perhaps who knows something is being planned. Five if you read this please consider staying involved, even if you decide to take a break from making pictures. Thank you.

danila

what's going on Five leaving? pumpkingirl down voted by me? I never vote less then a 4 when I think that a picture is just beautiful and a 5 when is excellent etc. I my self have been down voted many times, during this year or more I joined TD, I UNDERSTAND THE FEELING, AND I AGREE WITH MARG kiss system.I try to vote and comment as much as I can, having limited time,and I surely can appreciate a beautiful pic. I hope FIVE doesn't leave us !!

five

Danila has alleviated my annoyance tremendously.

I consider any vote below a 5 to be a down-vote because it has the effect of knocking the picture down, and a string of them looks intentional. Almost all of us, myself included, give a five or nothing; in that context, I have trouble reconciling very positive comments (for which I am always grateful) with less than a 5 vote, so i felt like the pic was just be knocked down -- hence my annoyance. In short, my annoyance is personal to me, and I apologize for that. As Danila rightly points out, people have different standards and as long as we have a 1 to 5 rating, she should be able to vote 4 if she feels a picture is not quite as good as what she would consider a 5. Having her explanation is so helpful!

I'd still like to keep my pics out of voting.

That said, I say let's hope TD goes with a straight "like" vote or no vote, and let's the algorthm account for the number of votes and favorites. Then no one has to worry about what makes a 3 or a 4 or a 5.

danila

YOU KNOW FIVE, I ALMOST FELT SO SAD ABOUT THIS ISSUE, FELT SAD FOR YOU, FOR PUMPKINGIRL,EVERY VOTE SHOULD COUNT, AND NO DOWN VOTING! IN MAY EXPERIENCE, AND MAY BE IGNORANCE, A DOWN VOTING IS WHEN A VOTE IS EQUAL TO 1 OR 2, AS THIS HAPPENED TO SOME OF MY PIC THAT HAD 1 OR 2 STARS, OUT OF 5, OR SHOWS HALF VOTE AFTER A NEW VOTE. MY APPRECIATION ON A PIC. IS, SURELY AS FOR MOST OF YOU, DETERMINED BY MANY FACTORS, COLOURS, LINES, EMOTIONS, PRECISION, FANTASY, STLE, ETC. BUT,AND THIS IS FOR ME AND MAY BE NOT FOR OTHERS: THE MELTING OF THE ELEMENT USED, NOT OFTEN I LIKE A PIC THAT TOTALLY OR BLUNTLY SHOWS THE ELEMENT USED AS IT IS. MANY TIMES A PIC.SEEMS VERY BEAUTIFUL WHEN IS SMALL AND BECOMES LESS BEAUTIFUL, TO MY EYES, WHEN ENLARGED IN THE PAGE TO RATE. THEREFORE ONE REASON MORE FOR A THE DIFFERENT VOTE. I HOPE TO HAVE NOT OFFENDED ANYONE AT ALL, I FIND TD A WONDERFUL PLACE, AND YOU ALL A GREAT COMUNITY, WHERE TO EXCHANGE PASSION, EMOTION, BEAUTY..THIS IS RARE!!!!! GLAD TO SEE I ALLEVIATED YOUR ANNOYANCE, YOUR ARE TOO TALENTED, A GIFT TO ALL OF US, EVERY ONE HERE IS A GIFT TO OTHERS!!!