matthew

...In fun; or in an attempt to be funny; I reposted my Jesus pic multiple times with the title "proselytizing"...

...proselytizing is a new word to me & I thought it funny to say so...

...TD & at least 3 others disagreed with my humor & not only censored those, but censored my original "IESVS NAZARENVS REX IVDEORVM" pic which was not funny or proselytizing...

...To that I say in my most Christian voice...

...Kiss My ###...

...Censor my pole dancer... I am ok... It was very adult... Enough so that I deleted it myself...

...Censor my religious freedom...

...NO...

...I will not stand for it...

...Love to all & goodbye...

...I will leave my pics up for 1 week for anyone who wishes a copy. After that I will be deleting them all...

cutegrl289

What the...

Matthew, this is ridiculous. Don't you know that as a Christian you WILL be persecuted? Especially a non-complacent Christian that voices their opinion. The best thing to do is stand strong and NOT walk away. If you decide to leave, I will be very disappointed.

mostblessedone

Matthew, I hope you will come back to read this. Christian to Christian, I think you are making a mistake by leaving.

I got the humor of "proselytizing". Perhaps not the best picture to use for a humorous point, but I don't believe you were trying to be heretical. You know God looks at the intentions of your heart.

"JESVS NAZARENVS REX IVDEORVM" was a very serious picture which was well portrayed.

The word "Christian" means "Christ follower". That means we not only wear the label, but also try to walk the walk. Our goal is for others to see Christ through us, and in so doing, to be drawn to Him. So, what would Jesus do?"

If you leave in a huff over your "rights", you will have left a bad impression of Christians in general. After all, are we not supposed to be forgiving? If you leave at all, you will be leaving a forum through which you can be a light for others. The only "rights" we have through Jesus are to inherit eternal life through Him, to serve Him through obedience to Him and through service to others, and to suffer on His behalf when the occassion arises because we are following Him on His path.

With all that said, my advice to you, which I know you did not ask for, is this:

If someone was offended by your pictures because they felt you dishonored Him, ask their forgiveness. They will freely give it, for they too are under His grace.

If someone was offended by your pictures because they are not Christians and "don't want your religion pushed on them", know this: they are offended because the Holy Spirit is warring with theirs and they don't like it. Let the Holy Spirit continue His work, and do not hinder it by putting yourself and your feelings of affront in the way.

You are a talented artist and a wonderful part of TD. Can you not find the grace to appologize, to forgive, and to stay around to love us and let us love you?

In Christ,
Ann

Luna

To me, reposting the Jesus picture multiple times came across as anger, not a statement of Christianity. That may be what the reaction was about. I don't think you are being persecuted for your faith. What would Jesus do?

Dragon

matthew, I'm not a religious person so and I couldn't speak with the passion of mostblessedone or the faith of Luna, but I feel I need to speak none the less. I'm sure I would not be the only one who would feel this site would be lacking something if you left. You've added so much fun to ThinkDraw and gained a lot of respect for your work. You've also helped others to improve their style by your tutorials. I really hope you do not leave in haste and anger because someone is small or petty enough to censor your work. I fully agree with you- censor the adult only stuff as it is on the racey side, but I don't understand people flagging religious work as offensive. Despite my agnosticness (not really sure if that's a word but you get what I mean) I am angry on your behalf for the fact that someone would censor it. I am a great believer in the freedom of speech and of religion. I hope you will stay and continue to wow us with your ingenuity. Plus, I have a feeling this "offended" person is doing it out of spite not any acutual feeling of offense.
Hoping we can all get past this.
Dragon

DMarla

I'm sure you already know this; I surly don't want you to go.

DMarla

If you do go maybe we'll run into each other on that site I told you about.

candr

...can totally understand the emotions there, but let's look at it from a different perspective. I think that those who would like to censor your religious freedom might now be clapping. After all, didn't they just take away one venue of expressing yourself just by offending you? Just a thought...

...another thought -- true religious freedom can only come through forgiveness.

...and one more -- remember, our whole relationship with Jesus is based on forgiveness (His toward us). Don't let unforgiveness get in the way of that relationship. (Colossians 3:13)

Oooo, I hope I didn't sound too preachy. It is just some of the same things I tell myself when I'm feeling put out about something.

And let me end with the words of an old song by the group "Pray for Rain",

...You’ve got to let go of the little things before they get you down.
You’ve got to let go or they'll drag you to the bottom and pull you down.
It's a war we all fight and compromise is the battle ground --
for if we're ever gonna grow we’ve got to let go....

I wish you the best!

LaDonna

Your perseverance and faith in the midst of all your persecutions and affliction which your endure, is a plain indication of God’s righteous judgment so that you will be considered worthy of the kingdom of God for which indeed you are suffering. For after all it is only just for God to repay with affection those who afflict you and to give relief to you who are afflicted. Found in 2 Thessalonians

Matthew; in my opinion you are defiantly being persecuted for you faith. satin is a liar and a thief who does not play fair he attacks when we are already suffering trials and uses people when they themselves cannot understand why, the people who are offended by The One and only true God do not even know why they are affined.
http://www.thinkdraw.com/picture.php?pictureId=26022 http://www.thinkdraw.com/picture.php?pictureId=25891 http://www.thinkdraw.com/picture.php?pictureId=25667 http://www.thinkdraw.com/picture.php?pictureId=25303 http://www.thinkdraw.com/picture.php?pictureId=25139 http://www.thinkdraw.com/picture.php?pictureId=25113 http://www.thinkdraw.com/picture.php?pictureId=24350 http://www.thinkdraw.com/picture.php?pictureId=24250 http://www.thinkdraw.com/picture.php?pictureId=23995 http://www.thinkdraw.com/picture.php?pictureId=23329
“If so - then how do you all justify the sheer volume of Jesus images?”
I found very few pictures that had a cross and less that had Jesus images in them 9 out of the last 600 pictures I was surprised that their weren’t more with the theme of peace and the month of love. Jesus is the first thing to come to mind when I think of them.
Matthew; you are the one who took the time to comment on my pictures and encourage me.
You are the one who was strong enough to remove any pictures that you may have done that might not be appropriate for our children, on your own.
You are the one who quickly responds to any question that we may have and try to help.
And your sense of humor even in your time of trail still makes us laugh and brings joy to so many.
Please stay and continue to be an example to us all. And let the Holy Spirit be a light to others.
Think Draw needs a light like you

solosater

Matthew, I too am a Christian and understand the need to stand up for my faith. I also have to say for myself it is a personal thing and not one I feel the need to share with people indiscriminately, that’s me. I know you’ve been going through a very trying time and are in need of comfort that your faith brings and certainly you have a right to that comfort (*2 Corinthians 1:3-7).

We all have to be reasonable when “Proselytizing,” which I don’t believe was you intent at all. I know how frustrating it can be when a word or thought or even a work of art is taken in a very wrong way. But at the same time it’s true what was said that all His followers would be persecuted, and in fact that it is proof of our Christianity (**John 15:18-21). It is also true that as a Christian you should be happy for the persecution you suffer as it is for the sake of your savior (***Matthew 5: 10-12).

The thing is though; you say you were just having fun, you say you were not proselytizing. If that is true and it was only in fun, why let it get to you? I personally do not believe that Jesus was crucified but that he was nailed to a stake or a tree, I won’t go into my reasons for my belief as I am not here to proselytize;-) I still see your pictures of the crucifixion as amazing, and touching. I don’t let my belief make me rigid to the point I can’t see your intent. I can see how a person going through what you and your family are going through presently would be thinking along the lines of a promised salvation. I have no problem with that; I don’t think anyone else does either. Also with the recent forum entries about how there has been a religious slant to a lot of the chat and a proselytizing wave, I can see the joke you were making. Why allow this to stop you from using an outlet that has obviously been a healthy one for you? So someone or even a few someones got a little uptight, do you have to be too? Just for fun here’s another scripture to look at (****Matthew 5:38-48,) this is the one about loving your enemy and turning the other cheek.

One final note on the subject, a large part of being a good Christian is setting a fine example. Matthew, from day one of my stint here on Think Draw, you have been the one to show me encouragement and appreciation, you always fine something good to say, you look for the good in others. I know there are days you hang out just commenting on other’s work, how nice it is for all of us to get that “way to go” or that “you’ve inspired me” or even that “LOL” (*****Matthew 5:14-16). I do hope you change your mind and stay here in spite of the few who cannot see the joke or who are so petty as to be offended by your fabulous work.

If we cannot convince you to stay please know you will be missed.

*3 Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, the Father of tender mercies and the God of all comfort, 4 who comforts us in all our tribulation, that we may be able to comfort those in any sort of tribulation through the comfort with which we ourselves are being comforted by God. 5 For just as the sufferings for the Christ abound in us, so the comfort we get also abounds through the Christ. 6 Now whether we are in tribulation, it is for YOUR comfort and salvation; or whether we are being comforted, it is for YOUR comfort that operates to make YOU endure the same sufferings that we also suffer. 7 And so our hope for YOU is unwavering, knowing as we do that, just as YOU are sharers of the sufferings, in the same way YOU will also share the comfort.

**18 If the world hates YOU, YOU know that it has hated me before it hated YOU. 19 If YOU were part of the world, the world would be fond of what is its own. Now because YOU are no part of the world, but I have chosen YOU out of the world, on this account the world hates YOU. 20 Bear in mind the word I said to YOU, A slave is not greater than his master. If they have persecuted me, they will persecute YOU also; if they have observed my word, they will observe YOURS also. 21 But they will do all these things against YOU on account of my name, because they do not know him that sent me.

***10 “Happy are those who have been persecuted for righteousness’ sake, since the kingdom of the heavens belongs to them.
11 “Happy are YOU when people reproach YOU and persecute YOU and lyingly say every sort of wicked thing against YOU for my sake. 12 Rejoice and leap for joy, since YOUR reward is great in the heavens; for in that way they persecuted the prophets prior to YOU.

****38 “YOU heard that it was said, ‘Eye for eye and tooth for tooth.’ 39 However, I say to YOU: Do not resist him that is wicked; but whoever slaps you on your right cheek, turn the other also to him. 40 And if a person wants to go to court with you and get possession of your inner garment, let your outer garment also go to him; 41 and if someone under authority impresses you into service for a mile, go with him two miles. 42 Give to the one asking you, and do not turn away from one that wants to borrow from you [without interest].
43 “YOU heard that it was said, ‘You must love your neighbor and hate your enemy.’ 44 However, I say to YOU: Continue to love YOUR enemies and to pray for those persecuting YOU; 45 that YOU may prove yourselves sons of YOUR Father who is in the heavens, since he makes his sun rise upon wicked people and good and makes it rain upon righteous people and unrighteous. 46 For if YOU love those loving YOU, what reward do YOU have? Are not also the tax collectors doing the same thing? 47 And if YOU greet YOUR brothers only, what extraordinary thing are YOU doing? Are not also the people of the nations doing the same thing? 48 YOU must accordingly be perfect, as YOUR heavenly Father is perfect.

*****14 “YOU are the light of the world. A city cannot be hid when situated upon a mountain. 15 People light a lamp and set it, not under the measuring basket, but upon the lampstand, and it shines upon all those in the house. 16 Likewise let YOUR light shine before men, that they may see YOUR fine works and give glory to YOUR Father who is in the heavens.

DMarla

I tell you what, why don't you keep your account open and think on it awhile. Think on this also; this low vote person clearly shows that they don't want anyone that can draw like you to get in their way, why let them gain this control. Just want to say too that a lot of people think to be Christian you have to be perfect, this is not so we are a work in progress as everyone else is. We just choose to have Jesus there beside/in us.

Dragon

I'd like to say for the record, I've never felt like I'm being preached to on this site. I may not go for the more Christian pics, but I appreciate the tremendous amount of work that goes into a lot of them, I also appreciate that a lot of people are very spiritual and enjoy having an outlet for that.

I have never felt like someone was trying to convert me with their art, just like they enjoyed expressing their faith.

I really hope this site doesn't become about censorship of any belief system, whether I follow it or not.

solosater

I agree, you are an agnostic, I’m a Christian, and I’m sure we have many and varied religions represented here on TD.

In my personal favorite quote of all time, “Can’t we all just get along?”

This is supposed to be a fun way to spend time and perhaps to tickle our brains a little along the way. Lets leave it at that!

matthew

...Keep in mind... Rachel does the censoring...

...All TD members can do is bring a pic to her attention...

...The censoring occured so quickly that I am of the oppinion that Rachel took this upon herself without us...

...I threw 6 pics up in a row...

...5 titled Proselytizing...

...The 6th was a giant candy "LOL" titled "just kidding...

...My plan was to put those 6 pics up to get a laugh & to delete them in the next day or two...

...Sorry if it offended anyone. It was not my intention...

...Persecution is one thing, But I am not running up to the romans & requesting my head be lopped off...

...Rachel chose to censor my pics... I want to share my pics, not my beliefs. My beliefs come out in some of my pics... My humor in others... Why would I wish to stay where I cant share my passions?

solosater

I wasn't online so I don't know but perhaps she thought it was a glitch? I know there was a post from her inre: the saving in a new window and switching themes, you know the one you responded to it.

I'm sure this is not likely but is it possible?

Also you do have to give Rachel some credit, I imagine it's not an easy choice to make but what with the recent, alleged, bible thumping and such perhaps she made the call based on that to prevent any offense. You know "the best defense is a good offense" or in this case the best defense is to avoid the offense.

Qsilv

Matthew -- why stay? Because we want you to!

Not stay where can't share your passions?? But, Matthew, love... you do! Lots of ways. And we take them into ourselves! That's sharing, isn't it?

Um... tell me you're not offended by my Yin-Yang... please?

You KNOW I certainly was no more trying to taunt you with that, than you were trying to proselytize with your Cross series -------and for the record, I *DID* see the bratty sweet humor in those!

Has it occurred to anyone here that Rachel herself may be a trifle stressed?
Why do we expect her to be all wise and perfect?

Can she have a bad day? How 'bout a bad week? No?

Ok, I can mentally hear some self-righteous voice saying-- "Not if she's taken on the shepherding of a site like this!" And to that voice I say, ahhh balderdash... she created it and she nurtures it, but she does NOT have to treat it like a profit-making corporation.

Newsflash, you guys... we... are... here.... as... her.... guests!

Matthew, life's not fair. You're getting an extra heavy dose now.
We love you. Please... stay with us?

brandon

http://www99.shopping.com/xGS-How_To_Draw_Characters~NS-1~linkin_id-8033132~cid-874499188~ semid1-www.thinkdraw.com

likemee

matthew, how you have the cheek to have a crack at rachel i do not understand!! anyone who wishes to, can report a picture and when three people have done so, it is removed from the gallery. i distinctly remember your prominence in the 'censorship' debate, and now it happens to you, you're acting like a child.

matthew

...If you remember... She has final determination...

...All religious pics are not being censored... Why censor mine...

...As for childish...

...I am acting childish...

...I am angry, confused & hurting over my mom...

...I am lashing out needlessly...

...I am crying randomly...

...I am laughing at stupid times...

...I am looking for attention...

...I want to be left alone...

...I am acting childish...

solosater

I think the issue is that the picture was one no one had a problem with the first time he put it out, then when he joked about proselytizing it was yanked. Also I don't know that he's so much upset with Rachel as with the situation, his iconic work is pulled but others' iconic works (crosses, yin&yang, and such) are not.

I shouldn't speak for matthew but I can understand him feeling singled out for centure in this.